Rosbalt,
Interview by
Translated by Howard Goldfinger
What can
After Turkey's special services
arrested Abdullah Odzhalan, the Kurdistan Workers'
Party (RPK), which he headed, first became the Kurdistan Congress of Freedom
and Democracy (KSDK) and then, quite recently, the Kurdistan People's Congress
(NKK). Are these strictly organizational changes or do they reflect ideological
changes in the Kurdish movement?
This was certainly not a mere
formality. The 21st century-the epoch of globalization-puts
democratic criteria first. If we stand outside the world system, we will
be unable to conduct ourselves successfully. The 40-million-strong Kurdish
people has been, till now, ignored and largely persecuted by the governments of
the countries in which it has lived. The aim and task of the NKK is a
democratic resolution of the Kurdish question in four countries (
The structure of the old RPK
reflected the reality of a world in which two military-political blocs opposed
each other but it could not meet the needs of the present. The change in the
party will allow the Kurdish people to express themselves in the new
conditions. The People's Congress is open to everyone. Our aim is to
lead the Kurdish people into the front ranks of those struggling for the
democratization of the
Are you saying that the NKK has
become a democratic party of the European type?
I would go so far as to say that the
People's Congress has gone beyond the usual European standards.
But the traditional Moslem social
order, to which most Kurds adhere, is thought to be hardly receptive to the
development and strengthening of democracy. Do you agree with that?
Yes, we recognize these
difficulties. However, it will be fully possible to develop democracy in the
We have encountered many
difficulties in the course of our history, and without the help of the rest of
the world, we will find things harder, especially because of the forces in the
region that seek to defend the status quo. But the world has shrunk greatly in
this age of globalization and the Internet, and we are confident that the
democratic Kurdish movement will find support in the rest of the world.
Winding up the topic of democracy,
can you say when, approximately, it will come to the
The Kurdish people are seeking to
realize it in their daily lives. Overall, democratization of the region will
take a long time and much effort.
In your view, what are the chances
of implementing the 'Road Map' put forward by the KSDK as the way to solve the
Kurdish problem?
Background:
The 'Road Map,' with its listing of specific proposals, is based on last fall's
analogous plan for the settlement of the Palestinian-Israeli crisis.
Originally, a deadline of
The second phase calls for specific
steps designed to build trust between the sides. Ankara would remove its ban on
discussions of the Kurdish problem, adopt a law for the full rehabilitation and
restoration of rights of guerrillas, political prisoners and political
emigrants, would improve the conditions under which Abdullah Odzhalan is held, would assist the start of economic growth
in Kurdistan and would make official apologies to the Kurdish people for
ignoring its problems and for its use of force. The Kurds promised to turn in
their arms and ammunition, return to
Finally, the third phase of the plan
would bring a full, democratic resolution of the Kurdish problem, including the
signing of a treaty of peace and concord with
We will continue to insist on the
demands laid out in the 'Road Map.' One of the main recent changes in the
region has been the expansion of the
Our aim is to achieve the rights
that all peoples have and to do so within the framework of existing borders,
while solidifying our rights under the constitutions of the countries in which
we live. We have no aim to break up any country. The Kurds support the
democratic, federal model of the new
What part of the 'Road Map' do you
consider the most difficult to achieve?
You mustn't think of the Kurdish
question merely as part of a regional agenda-it is a world question. The main
condition set by the Kurds is freeing our national leader, Abdullah Odzhalan. In general, our demands are substantially
democratic ones. The question is really about the mind-set of our opponents.
When that changes, I don't think any part of the 'Road Map' is unrealizable.
One mustn't forget the external forces that look at the Kurdish factor as their
trump card.
Do the Kurds want territorial
autonomy?
At present, the Kurdish People's
Congress has not set that as a goal, but we do not oppose, for example, the
form of self-definition that the Kurds in
[During negotiations at the end of
January between Turkish Prime Minister Redzhep Erdogan and US President George Bush, the latter declared
that the
We know the Kurds have conducted a
protracted armed struggle for their rights in
The Kurdish question is most
contentious in
Our guerrilla detachments still
exist. They have not been demobilized. We are not conducting major military
operations, but local clashes between our units and Turkish troops are
continuing as in the past. We retain the right to strike without warning if
force is used against our people or against Abdul Odzhalan.
The Kurdish question is still being ignored and, if a democratic resolution
isn't achieved, we will have no choice but to continue armed struggle. Don't
forget that the route of the Baku-Tbilisi-Ceyhan oil
pipeline runs through
You are ready to use the pipeline as
a lever to gain your ends?
If the Kurdish question is not
settled, armed action could be taken against the pipeline.
It's now been five years that
Abdullah Odzhalan has been in a Turkish prison. Does
he remain, in fact, the real national leader or has he become something like
what a portrait of Lenin is to orthodox Communists?
Adullah Odzhalan was elected president of the People's Congress at
its last convention. One mustn't look upon him merely as the leader of a party.
He is the national leader of the whole Kurdish people. The recent changes in
our organizational and political structure were made on the basis of
suggestions from him. His intellect has revived the Kurdish people, and it is a
mind held in appropriate regard. His activity is by no means merely symbolic.
He continues to defend the rights of the Kurdish people even in prison. One's
stance with respect to our leader is the equivalent of one's stance toward the
entire Kurdish people.
It's estimated that some 400,000-500,000
Kurds live in
We have always considered
Russia should more firmly stand up
for its interests in the Middle East, which will foster our closeness in
strategic terms, in that relations with the Kurds will strengthen Russia's
position in the region, now controlled by the Americans. We understand
perfectly
Are you sensing positive movement in
your direction from
We regret the role Russia played in
what happened to Abdullah Odzhalan [Moscow refused
him political asylum and, essentially, forced him out of Russia at a time when
Turkish special forces were on his trail, and thus abetted the eventual arrest
of Odzhalan.-Ya. A.], regret that it failed to
prevent events developing as they did. But much of that depended on the balance
of forces at that time. If
Is
Certainly.
However, there is a whole range of
international legal instrumentalities that can be used to wake
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